Honestly, I’m not sure what it was. To be fair, I didn’t give it a thorough look, but will say I was turned off by seeing the names Marianne Williamson and Michael Mann. But beyond that, I think for me, is the idea of another course, another group of talking heads, another attempt at solutions with esteemed guests. Information overload perhaps? I’m currently immersed in several books and several substacks and feel a bit at my limit. Also, I’m moving more and more towards this feeling that the solutions aren’t out “there”, but instead more local, starting with myself and then filtering to my local brick and mortar community. Just some thoughts off the cuff.
Why would Michael Mann be a turn off? I understand people might have issues with Williamson. But the thing is, some people are always going to have problems with almost anyone you get who has some fame and reputation. I feel that even "course" is just a word, or "Seminar." What this is intentionally created time and space where we can make a collective enquiry... I am open to help, research, motivate, organize, etc. Please check out the free brochure we just published. I think you would be a great addition and hope you change your mind.
I’m sorry nobody will respond when I ask about Marianne Williamson . To me she is an exciting candidate . When I read her emails from the campaign trail I find them direct smart and deep . I find she’s doing something active . That this crowd isn’t behind her politically confuses me . Perhaps everyone has given up on politics entirely ? Is that ethical ? How can there be a conference about what to do as we face and go closer to the crisis that includes her as a speaker and yet mentioning her run for the presidency inspires theatrical crickets audio ? I’m confused . I wish someone would tell me what I am missing . Or are all of you missing out ? Marianne Williamson seems important .
Yes I agree... I don't see her making a big dent in the presidential race but I think she is a very important voice and rare in bridging kind of the new age spirituality gestalt with actual politics and the ecological awareness. She has also been assailed a bit for treating her staff poorly at times, but everybody has problems and makes mistakes, particularly when they are trying to do something Herculean like challenge the political structure. I think we should cut her more slack, she has great messages and I appreciate your comment.
Oh hi, or I could ask you too. Why do you get that people might have issues with Marianne Williamson? What is the negative take on her? I'm naïve here, oblivious to politics chatter. From my personal experience , limited but direct, she seemed powerful and tuned in.
I am intending to sign up and have been since I heard that the course was taking place, just been busy. But I agree that I've read some pretty unedifying stuff about MW and it's probably not all disinformation. Jane Fonda is another person I can take or leave, but I'm willing to give her a chance. The less well known people are why I am going to do it, plus the great community discussions that always develop from a course like this. The last one was great.
If you get this would you let me know why seeing the name Marianne Williamson is a turn off?
I totally get the bigger picture and am with you regarding the dawning sense that the revolution starts at home, transformation of the self at ground zero and a radiating of change outwards.
But I'd be so grateful if someone would tell me what is the negative buzz about Marianne WIlliamson. I don't know if it's negative or just absolutely non existent but for some reason her presidential candidacy isn't taken seriously and I wonder why not . Can you give me some info?
Hi Daniel. I don’t often comment here, partly out of shyness but more often because I feel to share my thoughts properly would take hours. Since I viscerally feel your despair here, I’m stepping out of my comfort zone to answer your question as truthfully as possibly while also trying to be brief (which as we all know is harder than answering at length!)
The short answer, as far as my resistance to this type of program exploring our global catastrophe, is busyness (which I confess with a forlorn kind of shame). As a working parent of two kids, I just don’t ever feel like I have even one tiny crack in my schedule that is available. I am also grappling with changes in the economy and in my industry that are concerning and that require extra bandwidth to cope with and pivot around. When I see your programs, I read about them with huge interest - almost delight - and then I feel the familiar sense of overwhelm (the most intense type of overwhelm when considering the global scale) and then I just close the screen and go back to my parental, household and professional obligations. It is simply paralysis, which I suspect is felt by many.
But after reading your missive here I thought, perhaps I can just - to paraphrase Woody Allen - simply show up. I began thinking perhaps I could totally take myself off the hook by saying, “You don’t have to DO anything. Just show up and listen,” I started to feel perhaps I can do that.
I also know if I stop looking at it globally but really focusing on just my own little corner of the planet (i.e. my household), I suspect I might be inspired to “do” at least one or two small actions. Again, I don’t really feel that would make any difference, but at least it might be right dharma.
Anyway - you asked about what is happening on our end, so that’s my little sharing of what is happening with me. Thank you as always for your deep and broad thinking in all these difficult areas, and your gumption in responding. xx
I have a lot of ecologically attuned friends who have kids and all of their life energy (particularly for women) goes into the kids, which is what it is... I've argued elsewhere that the nuclear family model is very problematic and raising kids in tight communities makes so much more sense. But I don't understand how, if you know what's happening and have little kids, you aren't also feeling you have to deal with the ecological emergency as it will seriously compromise the quality of your kids' lives as adults... perhaps even curtail them. I find it strange that American and European parents lapse into kind of like parenthood hypnosis instead of being the ones who most powerfully engage in what's coming. I just don't understand this cognitive dissonance - not with you particularly. Your comment called this old thought stream up into my mind. x d
Hi Daniel. Of course, I feel the despondency more deeply because of my children but if I’m being honest the despair is strongest around humanity as a whole, the beauty of what could be and what we have lost/are losing. I don’t speak of what I’m experiencing as cognitive dissonance so much as about time management or trying to find more hours in a day. For example, if my dog is lying on his side panting due to a strange heart condition that has sprung up out of nowhere, I have to take him the vet. Am I just going to leave an animal lying there suffering? This is hours in a day. If I’m watching my daughter disappear before my eyes due to an eating disorder, am I not going to take her to a doctor, a nutritionist, a psychotherapist? This is hours in a day. If I’ve just heard my mother has died of cancer many miles away, am I not going to jump on a plane to coordinate and attend her funeral, not to mention clear out her house? (Many hours.)
These are events not peculiar to me but quotidian in the modern world. I yearn for the sort of tightly-knit small community you describe where joys, worries and responsibilities are all shared by folks beyond the nuclear family - not only because it sounds nice but it would be so much more efficient! But I don’t have that.
I agree with much of what you’ve written that capitalism, income inequity and the nuclear family in isolation all work together to keep most people struggling and disconnected and less able to tend to things that matter (I.e. the global ecological emergency). But ultimately this is the pond I’m swimming in and there are only so many hours in a day.
And just to clarify, all my life energy does not go into “my kids,” it goes into the “everything” of middle life - broken water heaters, leaky pipes, car at the mechanic, managing the finances, cleaning, grocery shopping, job responsibilities etc etc.
Perhaps I should add: My biggest focus right now is paring down my life, decluttering physically and embracing a more minimalistic lifestyle. Perhaps that is the key to my having more bandwidth available for this big ecological crisis that (of course) matters more than anything else.
So sorry to hear about your lost and troubles. I will do Powa practice for your mother ? What is her name? I did my spring cleaning too. Have adopted the system of if I buy something, something has to go. So that now for the past 15 years my decluttering has become easy. I have not reached the stage where I only have 32 pieces of clothing, but since I have bought very little in the last two years and I always give away nothing I did not use in the last year, it will eventually get there. I can relate to your troubles. My mom has Alzheimer’s and all of a sudden I had to stop working to care for her. It is disheartening to watch the deterioration of the human mimd. But it keeps me practicing and trying to care for mine well so that perhaps it won’t happen to me. I am here hoping that nothing happens to me before she dies. What would happen to her if I am gone? My sister is not interested in us and my brother lives in California. Too far away. The joys of decolonization. Yes, simplify as much as possible. Harder than we think, but worthwhile. Since you and Daniel long for small communities … do read “Like Water of the Spirit by Malidoma Some and “the Spirit of Intimacy”. Very wonderful if read in that order .
I was also turned off by Marianne Williamson and Michael Mann. They both seem played to a certain degree. Jem Bendal would be exciting!
I was initially excited by the idea but I think it’s more than a course—it needs to be a community, a turning point (or at least a turning of the wheel). What are people bringing to this course more than we can hear on a podcast? How are we invited into true participation with the ideas, and not just blankly receptive faces on a zoom screen? How do you make this reciprocal?
This is not meant to be snarky—I genuinely world like to know. I’m in a year long program with Gabor Maté which is asking a lot of us but as a result is t transformative in that reciprocal sense.
Actually, Gabor would be great to have in the course…
Well we have a Hylo social network which was great for the last seminar and I will keep it going (and growing) for this one. If we achieve some kind of critical mass, hopefully people can create local in-person groups, which is what we did years ago with The Evolver Network. We will also experiment with break-out rooms via Zoom... but yes, I am completely interested in reciprocity... I think it is valuable for people to see how different minds work in the present... Personally I am excited to ask some questions of Bill McKibben and others. Gail Bradbrook, one of the founders of XR, is doing some amazing work with leaders in the Global South. I think it will be a fantastic experience , hence I am advocating for it here in the comments at 6 am! Hope you will join us.
Sounds amazing, Daniel. Impressed with your enthusiasm, willingness to ask for feedback, and keep evolving the upcoming event, taking into account the suggestions offered here.
Dear Daniel- for me, and knowing what I know about humans- it’s in the title. The nervous system can be either regulated, hyper aroused (fight or flight) or hypo aroused (freeze). One can be in fight or flight all day or all week (“must” behaviors, seeking safety through action- anxiety, ADD, keep busy, OCD..) and then go into freeze at night or the weekend (“can’t” behaviors, seeking safety through dissociation- numbing addictions i.e alcohol and the like, depersonalization..)
Embracing emergency is a title that suggests a fatigue of the first, sending humans into the latter.
I very much appreciate your voice and at the same time would never opt for a course with such title.
Surprised that was the chosen title. I may be wrong as for others but that is my 2 cents for me. Hope it helps.
Love making up titles. How about Embracing Our Time? Do we think this might allow us the freedom to conjure up our own sense of emergency without feeling cornered? Appreciating your humble and brave openness Daniel.
Hi Joan, please see the respose to Osher... I like the title. I anticipated it would be shocking / annoying at first... hope you will join us. If price is an obstacle, we can offer scholarships, just tell us what feels right to you... hello@liminal.news
Hi Osher, I like the title. I wanted it to give people a bit of a shock at first. What if we took the very thing we always try to push away and embrace it, surrender into it, accept it, love it? We are not going to wish the ecological emergency away in our lifetimes. Our society is numb about it - utterly failing to adapt or change its practices. These brilliant thinkers and activists have had small successes but large failures. How interesting all of this is. How do we step beyond our own ego-cages and be with this? At the same time, a title is just a title. I am sorry you were triggered and hope you will reconsider and take the seminar as I feel you would have a lot to offer. If the price is an obstacle, we are flexible to people's needs - just email us - hello@liminal.news
Thank you, Osher, for helping me recognize/name a strange pattern that has set into my life over this past Winter. I haven’t been able to figure it out until your comment: “Must” hyper-alert behaviors all week due to work/responsibilities, followed by “can’t” paralysis behaviors all weekend due to exhaustion and overwhelm.
what would be a better title? I am trying to figure out how you make a "quantum leap" beyond panic or concern into saying, hey, this is the reality, we are in, lets then not only accept it but choose it, embrace it. It feels healing to me after the initial shock.
It's not just the "1% psychopaths"; Humanity needs to change. When gas prices go up, everybody bitches, when we should have greatly reduced our fossil fuel use (or maintained what we were doing in the 70's), quit flying so much, quit polluting waters and air, quit killing soils. It's hard for me to be angry with Monsanto (though they're horrific), they think round up and animal insecticides are necessary. I know really bright people who think GMOs are okay, yet we haven't had time to see their negative impacts (not all of them anyway). People who are really good people fly 20 times (or more) a year, arrange luxury travel for others. We have little choice when we try to eat decent food. Don't get me started on Big Pharma, they're killing us. Your neighborhood pharmacist has bought into their story. People, in general, are ignorant. That doesn't mean stupid, they just don't know. As horrible as it sounds, I wish the economy had collapsed years ago. Think back to the aftermath of 911 or the things that happened when COVID first hit and everything shut down...the air got immediately cleaner, animals came out of hiding, things were quite nice for those of us who weren't hiding at home. I could write a novel about it, but I often think, why bother? It's all been said.
While I’ve gleaned much from you over the years concerning the limits of materialism, I feel like I’ve gone down the path so far that I am only interested in subjects that talk about God. I don’t think a generalized spritituallity has the power to change us nor hold my attention. I think this is the only potent solution to materialism that is comprehensive, including practices, theology, and worship(proper orientation of attention and gratitude). I don’t expect you to go down this road but that is where I am at. I do recognize that we need economic and political strategies but I think we need a sturdy and robust theology to defend our souls from nihilism and AI.
I don't think we need a "robust theology" in a Christian sense, but a phllosophically grounded ontology, in alignment with science and physics, which monistic idealism provides. Idealism also allows for us to understand the power of myth and allegory, but I think we still want to avoid getting caught in literalism which would be regressive... I think it is subtle, multilayered the effort to hold what Gebser called "the integral-aperspectival" viewpoint. For me, the new Christianity of people like Kingsnorth, in trying to be an advance, is just a little bit of a regression. Sorry to say! Glad we can keep having this (and other) dialogues.
"new Christianity" is quite humorous when speaking of the Eastern Orthodoxy that Kingsnorth converted to. It is the most ancient form of the religion! I don't think anyone from that view point would call it an advance either. Maybe a 'return'. As CS Lewis wrote: “Progress means getting nearer to the place you want to be. And if you have taken a wrong turn, then to go forward does not get you any nearer. If you are on the wrong road, progress means doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road; and in that case the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive man.”
I would guess that we agree that scientific materialism is the wrong road, as you champion idealism, but I think a robust theology is the right goal. Christianity as I see it has a philosophically grounded ontology, aligns with science and physics (as far as it needs to, science can't contain all), but also provides so much more; Participation, mythology, practices, guidance of the Saints, Sacraments, iconography. How would one participate in idealism? It is not embodied as far as I can tell. It is going to be hard to beat the richness and depth of the mystical Logos theology of EO Christianity as far as I can tell.
AI is not the biggest threat at the moment. Quantum computing is far worse for everyone. They will be able to get into everyone’s bank account. That is what I call chaos .
You are right, of course in a certain way. Attention is a cherished mental factor as is mindfulness. And they are meant to be trained. Not many at it from what I can gather. But what I meant JR is that all these distractions are meant to place our attention elsewhere so the damage can be done without scrutiny - and then it is too late for anything. I mentioned money, (Of which I have none) ,but what I really meant is control. All of these things happening, like the pandemic lockdowns were tests geared towards control. How far can we press their buttons? I feel we still have a chance to fight it, but with Quantum computing it will be harder for us to have any kind of freedom. Everyone's attention will be arrested by survival and then there will be no place for discussions of any kind. We will be too busy looking for the next meal. How long can you fast for without loosing the rag? And can you watch others eat, while you are hungry and not feel like walloping someone over the head to ease your own discomfort ? This are the kind of things that concern me. The most civilised man can turn appy at a moments notice. I am a child of war, and I know what mankind is capable of. We all do. If things go pear shaped , am I training myself to continue to be kind and grateful as I should be at all times, or will I easily revert to my primal animalistic state if the shit really hits the fan? I am focusing on these kinds of questions to myself and how I can answer them today and tomorrow and in case chaos is unleashed upon us. No one can really tell what is coming. I know of three wars unleashed on citizens of the world , this world , our world , in the last three years. Above all else, I long for a peaceful earth. But a peaceful earth will come about when the minds of men are peaceful. And that looks like a mighty long time away. You will own. nothing and be happy. Funny because it is true (Homer would say), but it has to be accepted voluntary not imposed upon us. DOn't you think?
I agree with you mostly, but attention is not just a mental factor or function. The way in which we attend to the world manifests the world that we see. Attention is not a practice like mindfulness but is the very thing we interface with reality through. Dr Iain McGilchrist's work on the different types of attention that our brain hemispheres pay to the world, shows us what is at stake here if our we are dominated by the narrow and limited attention of the left-hemisphere. Entertain means 'to hold' and if we are captive to our screens and if it is all we 'pay' our attention to then we will lose touch with reality and we will die by insanity. Attention is our most valuable currency so we must be attentive to what we are paying it to.
I do know his work, he is incredible, but here I am using what I know of the mind from 35 years as a meditator and attention is a mental factor indeed, one of the 51 mental factors our mind has together with intention, mindfulness, faith , all mental factors so the idea is to look upon the mind as a diamond with many facets all of which need polishing and care. so like Bruce Lee referring to the body, you train all your muscles so that "when you need it, it does it all by itself (or something to that effect) so it is with the mind. train everything for the more training the better it work. I think I saw your name on another comment on a different substack post. I will check again. I do not spend more than half an hour replying even though sometimes I would like too. Yes, we have to control our impulses and not let ourselves be controlled by them. So I have to leave substack (comments) to actually write my next Wednesday post, but I enjoyed seeing the lady on Dr Iain McGilchrist's documentary (which name escapes me at the moment) and the lady that was in an accident and sculpted many brains. Every part of the brain records a kind of work, language, spacial awareness, etc. This was clear to me since ( I don't know if you recall) the awful sad case of the Romanian babies who did not get touch as part of their upbringing and parts of their brain was (dead) or underdeveloped or not developed at all. So people that have to have parts of their brain removed for whatever reason are showing us these things which I think it is incredible, but at what cost to each individual…
Well I suppose I disagree with your definition of attention, it sounds to me like you are talking about focus, which I see as being part of attention or a kind of attention. The other kind of attention has a much broader scope, more holistic and interconnected view of the world, which can’t be trained but can be ignored as it is more subtle and isn’t good at making money and manipulating but is essential for the health of the mind and soul.
With absolute honesty, since you asked, I'm inclined to pass because: 1) I just haven't the availability, 2) I've been in some real dire financial straights lately, and the big one, 3) climate change is not at all on my radar anymore. Civilization will be tanked long before it ever becomes a real issue—any of us paying attention can see society's free fall. And, if I'm to be really honest, I have zero trust anymore for the scientific community—they have been bought and corrupted just like medicine, education, and of course government. Many scientists emphatically state there is no climate crisis and others say we are doomed. What I do know, because I can see it with my own eyes, is that society as we've always known it is collapsing. Can you even imagine Western nations that will still be Western nations in 20 years? I'm rather concerned that, whether by international conflict or Islamic invasion, we will be sent back to the Dark Ages. That is the pressing peril I am concerned with. That said, I applaud you for your involvement with this event, it is just not of interest to me in my current state of disillusionment. I hope that you don't become dejected in any way but continue to pour your passion into this project. At the end of the day, we all still need to be thinking more sustainably about the long-term and that I can always get behind.
Your comment hit home - thank you for the resonant points you made. I am so disillusioned and dejected lately that it’s bordering on paralysis and affecting my ability to show up for much of anything. I signed up for Daniels offering out of curiosity and a need for solidarity.
Thank you, it will be a wonderful and important event. I am absolutely positive it will be encouraging to be a part of something with so many other concerned individuals. Sometimes it is very empowering to realize we are not alone in how we feel.
“What I do know, because I can see it with my own eyes, is that society as we've always known it is collapsing.” Well put Aaron. In my view, I wonder if we have exhausted the ‘benefits’ of democracy and capitalism which are now a joke. What ‘sphere’ could add another dimension to this ‘flatland’? Re that, I am reading Adventures in Quantumland” by Ruth E. Kastner and exploring Rudolf Steiner’s intriguingly radical concept of a “threefold social organism”.
Thank you, not familiar with the concept. I appreciate your comment and I'll try to research the threefold social "organism" (I read that incorrectly the first time—I think I have selective dyslexia). :)
I’m still trying to get a sense of it too. A place to start might be The Whole Social Substack. I’m sure Daniel is aware that the meditant Rudolf Steiner worked to apply his insights to practical alternatives in education, agriculture, medicine, the arts and also social forms.
Hey Daniel, take what I say with a grain of salt because I've often found that I enjoy learning at my own pace as opposed to online courses, and only really sign up for an online course if I feel there's someone I really admire that I want to learn from directly.
I'm honestly sick of courses that are just a collection of 1 hour seminars by different speakers. I find each person often just presents an intro to their ideas, and we never really get deep.
This is great if I want a broad intro to a topic, but these days I'm decently well versed in these things and courses only appeal if I feel there's going to be real depth.
This is why your esotericism course appeals to me more. It's not even the topic so much as the way you present it, you are structuring it in a way that I feel I'd learn a lot.
This particular course doesn't feel that way to me. I'd be more interested in you or you and one other person doing something thoughtfully structured and focused than an assortment of people each doing one hour stand alone seminars.
Again this is where my interests are and not necessarily representative of others. And again I am a self motivated learner and it's rare that I'd sign up for anything at this point, though just signed up for a Buddhist Geeks course on The Second Turning as I love the teachers and it's clear they are going into depth on topics that really interest me.
For sure, but I have limited time and money and I know what my priority is. I'd rather listen to podcasts for free on my own time to get a similar depth of information. For me courses are about going deep into certain topics, deeper than you can get in an hour or two.
Again, this is just my preference, how I prioritize my time and money.
I do think something is different about the live events even online... you are in the moment of creation of a possible new thought or idea. I think Gail B, Bill McKibben, etc, you will learn a lot from the time with them, no matter what.
Gee I guess I assumed that Daniel would do a kind of assimilation at the end… he’s so good at distilling complex ideas, synthesizing and making things clear. At least for me. Perhaps he will do something like that!
The Heart Room is open! Yes I find taking care of one’s own mind being the priority. If that is in good shape, then everything else is not so hard to bear . I find it important to contemplate what I did at the end of each day so that if I did not help, at least it did no harm. My
most pertinent question at the moment is not why things are so bad in this or that field of existence, but why do we have the karma to experience it in this way? At this particular time? We have been killing, pillaging and raping each other ever since we got here. It is not surprising to me that things are bad. I know they will probably get a lot worse . The predictions of displaced populations due to climate, war and what not is horrendous. Unfortunately, human nature, as well as noble it also has that side where until something really terrible happens to each of us personally, we rather brush it under the carpet. But karma always rippers. It is only a matter of time. I fell for instance that lockdown in general was good for humanity. People have been asleep. Covid made the intent of control more obvious. Our monetary system has always been a prison. A sophisticated kind of slavery, hidden by the complications of understanding such a complex system. A system specifically designed to keep us on a certain behavioral course. Convincente to the few. We have an alternative now, but will we grab that chance for financial freedom? Time will tell. But by now , freedom really means freedom from this unsatisfactory reality which no matter how many changes we can do to it, it will be always that- unsatisfactory. Suffering is its nature and to think that we can change the nature of that reality is foolish. Go forth, go forth and find true freedom!
I do toggle between feeling hopeless that we can effectively prevent collapse and just sort of trying not to think about it. To be honest I found the doom-sayers in the last seminar to be more on-target but depressing, and those with plans/ideas for how to live in accord with nature, etc to be kidding themselves and so that stuff frustrated me. It’s such an overwhelming thing for most of us to contemplate. I loved the talk you did with Jared Sexton. I think he’s dead on-target when he states that capitalism has sort of destroyed our ability to even imagine a better way of being in the world. I will think about signing up for the course some more. I’m most interested in the spiritual/mystical aspects of what we are going through. Somehow that resonates more to me than practical strategies for survival. Peace!
Hi Jon, Amazing if you can join, will be great to have you. I recommend Greer's book Dark Age America... feels like he might have a true perspective. But I can never shake Chris Bache's vision in Dark Night, Early Dawn entirely out of my head! Kind regards, D
This may not be useful but the number of “summits” and conferences of all kinds, with highly knowledgeable people, is staggering. I don’t have time for any of them. My first thought is always the same: just send me the transcript. I can go through it in a fraction of the time.
Is that enough? In brief. My wife and i spent over twenty years building an off-grid school based in Devon in the convivial style of illitch.... When parents came i said we could teach children how to spell consciousness but it may be more helpful to show and explore what that word may mean. We built a crucible (after Findhorn the early days, certainly not now) where everyone was welcome, where all had a unique gift to share and we said "yes" to almost everything. We held space to explore and experiment in a place of connection.
Daniel, after 20 odd years it was time to move on. What did i learn in that time? far more than this brief post will allow., but ..Well we learnt magic is real and we created a charming enchanted place of learning. We also gleaned that folk often want to use "your" crucible to place their stories in...a place where they can play at taking some weight, some responsibility (after vanessa andriotti and Stephen Jenkinson) but in reality. No not really. "No I dont really want to relinquish any of my stuff ,my money or privilege. In fact i dont even want to pay for your services because; "i am an artist" and a forest of other strange reasons to fracture and fragment.
We now find ourselves back at Findhorn (after 40 years) and its as messy and full of hubris as the rest of the planet. The community here is trying to buy the land from the effectively bankrupt Findhorn Foundation.
A few holding fast to the center. "can it hold"
Well who knows, perhaps not... but it has to be tried because we need to leave at least a sense or some small echo in the atmosphere for those that follow... a sense that someone gave a damn.
Hi OAKWOOD, thanks! Interesting to learn about Findhorn today and your journey. I feel you would be a great participant for the seminar. As I have mentioned, we don't want money to be an obstacle so please, if you do want to join but the price is an issue, email us at hello@liminal.news and let's work it out.
Yes, another course by more "thought leaders," authors and political activists. It's overwhelming. And yes, everyone listed has done a tremendous amount of good. I applaud them, especial you, Daniel. I've "raged against the machine" since before the first Earth Day. I'm exhausted. I still try to give because I still receive. For me, though, I just want to chop wood and carry water. I don't need a course for that.
Hi Stevo, Thanks for your comment which makes sense to me. I think, though, if you follow my writing and my work, you should know that I at least have the aspiration to try to help build a different kind of social movement, one that is outside of the political duopoly and that has a foundation in a consciousness-based paradigm (monistic idealism). Personally, I think that is the only "hope" (although, on another level, everything is perfect, Samsara is Nirvana, and there is nothing to hope for or worry about). I feel that your exhaustion (and mine) would dissolve and turn into energetic inspiration if we could somehow get the ball rolling in a different direction... perhaps that is an impossible dream, but I prefer to hold onto some kind of impossible dream. Bringing aspects of the movement into dialogue and building community around it feels like a good first step... I can't guarantee there will be a second step, but we will try. Please consider taking the seminar - if the price is problematic, please message us about what feels good for you - hello@liminal.news
You assembled a great line up and I’m interested but, like many have commented here, I’ve been following these ideas for years. I started with Greer in 2006 and broadly accept his thesis that a slow, sporadic decline, punctuated with crisis is the future. Well, actually it’s the present and therein lies the issue. It feels like the time for talk and exploration is done- now we’re working on practical solutions. I realise I have a tenuous future in Communications now that AI has arisen. I know our politics in the UK is headed into authoritarian territory. I know wealth inequality is intensifying and what we have may yet be lost. I know we have all the solutions but we’re not putting them into action because there is scant support. Who will create a mutual society to cushion each others financial needs? Who will join a grassroots trade network to support our artistic and agricultural endeavours? We need to birth a new alternative.
“Who will create a mutual society to cushion each others financial needs? Who will join a grassroots trade network to support our artistic and agricultural endeavours? We need to birth a new alternative.” Thank you Dan. And I propose expanding “support our artistic and agricultural endeavors” to include holistic self-motivating educational practice for children and youth to age 21.
I'm 80 years old and have lived and observed, in real time, through what I consider to be the most acceleratingly destructive period in the history of our democracy. Daniel, I believe that I have contacted you about this before, but in your course description didn't notice any reference to my primary concern, that being humanity's handicap -- which is now, and always have been, those 1% of us who are psychopathic. Until we rapidly utilize the new technology that, for the first time in human history, have at our disposal -- we are certainly doomed!
Yes. That’s the so-called “fall” (failure to rise) - that cold fear that shrinks our soul into selfish greedy takers and users. I think this theme rose to the top again with the academy-award winning new film The Zone of Interest.
I sometimes wonder if those traits we label “psychopathic” or “sociopathic “ are merely adaptive evolutionary strategies. Like cockroaches of the mind.
sponsored by Tribes in Nevada in mid April....survival, ...ceremonies APRIL 14
..It's FREE it's networking there's a raffle 😘🍀..people are fed .and it plans to call into ACTION....protests against lithium mines, out West, on native lands ...perhaps start with what we can DO....refuse to buy into for instance " electric cars are GREEN"...etc xo
yikes!! NEVER..EVER..either or....for silly goose sakes!.... I was saying, if you read carefully, that perhaps your sad arises from non interest...because you are using a tired burned out model for gathering people together: pay $$$ ..meet " big names" and listen to lectures etc. argh... it may be your FORMAT is a turn off ... and so I provided a link to an event addressing survival concerns in a way that is grassroots, inclusive. .as an example of how you MIGHT frame your " events" differently...all this shared because you solicited feedback via " sad" persona....you see?
hmm....my dear...Daniel ASKED for feedback....did you see that in his essay here?? I offered it in earnest...
and I was quoting, Daniel. by using his own word...."sad" as to HONOR his very own sentiments ...am personally not into banter here.....and I sure hope my reply to Daniel cleared up the " either or" conjecture about which he was querying. maybe you aren't following the entire stream of discourse Jess...hard to know. that all said....I've never worn make-up..never HAVE worried about " looking bad"...( yes quoting YOU....Whilst smiling, with peace sign flashin) xo
sidebar: ....but it's interesting that you took those little Chas Chas as mean spirited. truth? I lOvE daniel..2 decades and counting..synchronicities found us...he knows ..xo
I felt sad when I read your message Daniel, about the lack of response to this course, and I just signed up. I hestitated yesterday because I'm trying to save money, and I very much appreciated the discount. I have a lot of admiration for the work you and your colleagues are doing in bringing this together, and in my capacity as a climate journalist, I have had extensive interactions with several of your speakers. I'm excited about the sessions and plan to write about them for my newsletter Resonant World which seeks to bring a collective and inter-generational trauma lens to the climate crisis, and our crises more broadly. (I also loved How Soon is Now, which I can remember buying in Watkins Books in London when it came out). See you there!
Honestly, I’m not sure what it was. To be fair, I didn’t give it a thorough look, but will say I was turned off by seeing the names Marianne Williamson and Michael Mann. But beyond that, I think for me, is the idea of another course, another group of talking heads, another attempt at solutions with esteemed guests. Information overload perhaps? I’m currently immersed in several books and several substacks and feel a bit at my limit. Also, I’m moving more and more towards this feeling that the solutions aren’t out “there”, but instead more local, starting with myself and then filtering to my local brick and mortar community. Just some thoughts off the cuff.
Why would Michael Mann be a turn off? I understand people might have issues with Williamson. But the thing is, some people are always going to have problems with almost anyone you get who has some fame and reputation. I feel that even "course" is just a word, or "Seminar." What this is intentionally created time and space where we can make a collective enquiry... I am open to help, research, motivate, organize, etc. Please check out the free brochure we just published. I think you would be a great addition and hope you change your mind.
I’m sorry nobody will respond when I ask about Marianne Williamson . To me she is an exciting candidate . When I read her emails from the campaign trail I find them direct smart and deep . I find she’s doing something active . That this crowd isn’t behind her politically confuses me . Perhaps everyone has given up on politics entirely ? Is that ethical ? How can there be a conference about what to do as we face and go closer to the crisis that includes her as a speaker and yet mentioning her run for the presidency inspires theatrical crickets audio ? I’m confused . I wish someone would tell me what I am missing . Or are all of you missing out ? Marianne Williamson seems important .
Yes I agree... I don't see her making a big dent in the presidential race but I think she is a very important voice and rare in bridging kind of the new age spirituality gestalt with actual politics and the ecological awareness. She has also been assailed a bit for treating her staff poorly at times, but everybody has problems and makes mistakes, particularly when they are trying to do something Herculean like challenge the political structure. I think we should cut her more slack, she has great messages and I appreciate your comment.
Oh hi, or I could ask you too. Why do you get that people might have issues with Marianne Williamson? What is the negative take on her? I'm naïve here, oblivious to politics chatter. From my personal experience , limited but direct, she seemed powerful and tuned in.
I am intending to sign up and have been since I heard that the course was taking place, just been busy. But I agree that I've read some pretty unedifying stuff about MW and it's probably not all disinformation. Jane Fonda is another person I can take or leave, but I'm willing to give her a chance. The less well known people are why I am going to do it, plus the great community discussions that always develop from a course like this. The last one was great.
Oh hi!
If you get this would you let me know why seeing the name Marianne Williamson is a turn off?
I totally get the bigger picture and am with you regarding the dawning sense that the revolution starts at home, transformation of the self at ground zero and a radiating of change outwards.
But I'd be so grateful if someone would tell me what is the negative buzz about Marianne WIlliamson. I don't know if it's negative or just absolutely non existent but for some reason her presidential candidacy isn't taken seriously and I wonder why not . Can you give me some info?
I'm not familiar much with Williamson but think it's a complicated story, the negative sentiments I've seen are:
- https://www.politico.com/news/2023/03/16/marianne-williamson-abusive-treatment-2020-campaign-staff-00087268
- https://www.conspirituality.net/episodes/brief-marianne-williamsons-spiritual-therapy-schtick
...and yet there's also seeing the complexity of such people, holding their daring calls for peace despite the troubling history:
- https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/bonus-sample-so-marianne-williamson-really-is-the/id1515827446?i=1000635412087
Hi Daniel. I don’t often comment here, partly out of shyness but more often because I feel to share my thoughts properly would take hours. Since I viscerally feel your despair here, I’m stepping out of my comfort zone to answer your question as truthfully as possibly while also trying to be brief (which as we all know is harder than answering at length!)
The short answer, as far as my resistance to this type of program exploring our global catastrophe, is busyness (which I confess with a forlorn kind of shame). As a working parent of two kids, I just don’t ever feel like I have even one tiny crack in my schedule that is available. I am also grappling with changes in the economy and in my industry that are concerning and that require extra bandwidth to cope with and pivot around. When I see your programs, I read about them with huge interest - almost delight - and then I feel the familiar sense of overwhelm (the most intense type of overwhelm when considering the global scale) and then I just close the screen and go back to my parental, household and professional obligations. It is simply paralysis, which I suspect is felt by many.
But after reading your missive here I thought, perhaps I can just - to paraphrase Woody Allen - simply show up. I began thinking perhaps I could totally take myself off the hook by saying, “You don’t have to DO anything. Just show up and listen,” I started to feel perhaps I can do that.
I also know if I stop looking at it globally but really focusing on just my own little corner of the planet (i.e. my household), I suspect I might be inspired to “do” at least one or two small actions. Again, I don’t really feel that would make any difference, but at least it might be right dharma.
Anyway - you asked about what is happening on our end, so that’s my little sharing of what is happening with me. Thank you as always for your deep and broad thinking in all these difficult areas, and your gumption in responding. xx
I have a lot of ecologically attuned friends who have kids and all of their life energy (particularly for women) goes into the kids, which is what it is... I've argued elsewhere that the nuclear family model is very problematic and raising kids in tight communities makes so much more sense. But I don't understand how, if you know what's happening and have little kids, you aren't also feeling you have to deal with the ecological emergency as it will seriously compromise the quality of your kids' lives as adults... perhaps even curtail them. I find it strange that American and European parents lapse into kind of like parenthood hypnosis instead of being the ones who most powerfully engage in what's coming. I just don't understand this cognitive dissonance - not with you particularly. Your comment called this old thought stream up into my mind. x d
Hi Daniel. Of course, I feel the despondency more deeply because of my children but if I’m being honest the despair is strongest around humanity as a whole, the beauty of what could be and what we have lost/are losing. I don’t speak of what I’m experiencing as cognitive dissonance so much as about time management or trying to find more hours in a day. For example, if my dog is lying on his side panting due to a strange heart condition that has sprung up out of nowhere, I have to take him the vet. Am I just going to leave an animal lying there suffering? This is hours in a day. If I’m watching my daughter disappear before my eyes due to an eating disorder, am I not going to take her to a doctor, a nutritionist, a psychotherapist? This is hours in a day. If I’ve just heard my mother has died of cancer many miles away, am I not going to jump on a plane to coordinate and attend her funeral, not to mention clear out her house? (Many hours.)
These are events not peculiar to me but quotidian in the modern world. I yearn for the sort of tightly-knit small community you describe where joys, worries and responsibilities are all shared by folks beyond the nuclear family - not only because it sounds nice but it would be so much more efficient! But I don’t have that.
I agree with much of what you’ve written that capitalism, income inequity and the nuclear family in isolation all work together to keep most people struggling and disconnected and less able to tend to things that matter (I.e. the global ecological emergency). But ultimately this is the pond I’m swimming in and there are only so many hours in a day.
And just to clarify, all my life energy does not go into “my kids,” it goes into the “everything” of middle life - broken water heaters, leaky pipes, car at the mechanic, managing the finances, cleaning, grocery shopping, job responsibilities etc etc.
Perhaps I should add: My biggest focus right now is paring down my life, decluttering physically and embracing a more minimalistic lifestyle. Perhaps that is the key to my having more bandwidth available for this big ecological crisis that (of course) matters more than anything else.
So sorry to hear about your lost and troubles. I will do Powa practice for your mother ? What is her name? I did my spring cleaning too. Have adopted the system of if I buy something, something has to go. So that now for the past 15 years my decluttering has become easy. I have not reached the stage where I only have 32 pieces of clothing, but since I have bought very little in the last two years and I always give away nothing I did not use in the last year, it will eventually get there. I can relate to your troubles. My mom has Alzheimer’s and all of a sudden I had to stop working to care for her. It is disheartening to watch the deterioration of the human mimd. But it keeps me practicing and trying to care for mine well so that perhaps it won’t happen to me. I am here hoping that nothing happens to me before she dies. What would happen to her if I am gone? My sister is not interested in us and my brother lives in California. Too far away. The joys of decolonization. Yes, simplify as much as possible. Harder than we think, but worthwhile. Since you and Daniel long for small communities … do read “Like Water of the Spirit by Malidoma Some and “the Spirit of Intimacy”. Very wonderful if read in that order .
It sounds like you are doing great and the last thing I would want to do is put more pressure on you! x D
thank you Heather! helpful to hear all of this.
I was also turned off by Marianne Williamson and Michael Mann. They both seem played to a certain degree. Jem Bendal would be exciting!
I was initially excited by the idea but I think it’s more than a course—it needs to be a community, a turning point (or at least a turning of the wheel). What are people bringing to this course more than we can hear on a podcast? How are we invited into true participation with the ideas, and not just blankly receptive faces on a zoom screen? How do you make this reciprocal?
This is not meant to be snarky—I genuinely world like to know. I’m in a year long program with Gabor Maté which is asking a lot of us but as a result is t transformative in that reciprocal sense.
Actually, Gabor would be great to have in the course…
Hi Nico,
Well we have a Hylo social network which was great for the last seminar and I will keep it going (and growing) for this one. If we achieve some kind of critical mass, hopefully people can create local in-person groups, which is what we did years ago with The Evolver Network. We will also experiment with break-out rooms via Zoom... but yes, I am completely interested in reciprocity... I think it is valuable for people to see how different minds work in the present... Personally I am excited to ask some questions of Bill McKibben and others. Gail Bradbrook, one of the founders of XR, is doing some amazing work with leaders in the Global South. I think it will be a fantastic experience , hence I am advocating for it here in the comments at 6 am! Hope you will join us.
Sounds amazing, Daniel. Impressed with your enthusiasm, willingness to ask for feedback, and keep evolving the upcoming event, taking into account the suggestions offered here.
He is a wonderful man. Happy for your progress .
Dear Daniel- for me, and knowing what I know about humans- it’s in the title. The nervous system can be either regulated, hyper aroused (fight or flight) or hypo aroused (freeze). One can be in fight or flight all day or all week (“must” behaviors, seeking safety through action- anxiety, ADD, keep busy, OCD..) and then go into freeze at night or the weekend (“can’t” behaviors, seeking safety through dissociation- numbing addictions i.e alcohol and the like, depersonalization..)
Embracing emergency is a title that suggests a fatigue of the first, sending humans into the latter.
I very much appreciate your voice and at the same time would never opt for a course with such title.
Surprised that was the chosen title. I may be wrong as for others but that is my 2 cents for me. Hope it helps.
Love making up titles. How about Embracing Our Time? Do we think this might allow us the freedom to conjure up our own sense of emergency without feeling cornered? Appreciating your humble and brave openness Daniel.
Hi Joan, please see the respose to Osher... I like the title. I anticipated it would be shocking / annoying at first... hope you will join us. If price is an obstacle, we can offer scholarships, just tell us what feels right to you... hello@liminal.news
Hi Osher, I like the title. I wanted it to give people a bit of a shock at first. What if we took the very thing we always try to push away and embrace it, surrender into it, accept it, love it? We are not going to wish the ecological emergency away in our lifetimes. Our society is numb about it - utterly failing to adapt or change its practices. These brilliant thinkers and activists have had small successes but large failures. How interesting all of this is. How do we step beyond our own ego-cages and be with this? At the same time, a title is just a title. I am sorry you were triggered and hope you will reconsider and take the seminar as I feel you would have a lot to offer. If the price is an obstacle, we are flexible to people's needs - just email us - hello@liminal.news
Thank you, Osher, for helping me recognize/name a strange pattern that has set into my life over this past Winter. I haven’t been able to figure it out until your comment: “Must” hyper-alert behaviors all week due to work/responsibilities, followed by “can’t” paralysis behaviors all weekend due to exhaustion and overwhelm.
what would be a better title? I am trying to figure out how you make a "quantum leap" beyond panic or concern into saying, hey, this is the reality, we are in, lets then not only accept it but choose it, embrace it. It feels healing to me after the initial shock.
Elevator- I have replied to you with some titles, new to replying on substack (first reply ever) so it went below not sure if you can see it.
It's not just the "1% psychopaths"; Humanity needs to change. When gas prices go up, everybody bitches, when we should have greatly reduced our fossil fuel use (or maintained what we were doing in the 70's), quit flying so much, quit polluting waters and air, quit killing soils. It's hard for me to be angry with Monsanto (though they're horrific), they think round up and animal insecticides are necessary. I know really bright people who think GMOs are okay, yet we haven't had time to see their negative impacts (not all of them anyway). People who are really good people fly 20 times (or more) a year, arrange luxury travel for others. We have little choice when we try to eat decent food. Don't get me started on Big Pharma, they're killing us. Your neighborhood pharmacist has bought into their story. People, in general, are ignorant. That doesn't mean stupid, they just don't know. As horrible as it sounds, I wish the economy had collapsed years ago. Think back to the aftermath of 911 or the things that happened when COVID first hit and everything shut down...the air got immediately cleaner, animals came out of hiding, things were quite nice for those of us who weren't hiding at home. I could write a novel about it, but I often think, why bother? It's all been said.
While I’ve gleaned much from you over the years concerning the limits of materialism, I feel like I’ve gone down the path so far that I am only interested in subjects that talk about God. I don’t think a generalized spritituallity has the power to change us nor hold my attention. I think this is the only potent solution to materialism that is comprehensive, including practices, theology, and worship(proper orientation of attention and gratitude). I don’t expect you to go down this road but that is where I am at. I do recognize that we need economic and political strategies but I think we need a sturdy and robust theology to defend our souls from nihilism and AI.
I don't think we need a "robust theology" in a Christian sense, but a phllosophically grounded ontology, in alignment with science and physics, which monistic idealism provides. Idealism also allows for us to understand the power of myth and allegory, but I think we still want to avoid getting caught in literalism which would be regressive... I think it is subtle, multilayered the effort to hold what Gebser called "the integral-aperspectival" viewpoint. For me, the new Christianity of people like Kingsnorth, in trying to be an advance, is just a little bit of a regression. Sorry to say! Glad we can keep having this (and other) dialogues.
"new Christianity" is quite humorous when speaking of the Eastern Orthodoxy that Kingsnorth converted to. It is the most ancient form of the religion! I don't think anyone from that view point would call it an advance either. Maybe a 'return'. As CS Lewis wrote: “Progress means getting nearer to the place you want to be. And if you have taken a wrong turn, then to go forward does not get you any nearer. If you are on the wrong road, progress means doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road; and in that case the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive man.”
I would guess that we agree that scientific materialism is the wrong road, as you champion idealism, but I think a robust theology is the right goal. Christianity as I see it has a philosophically grounded ontology, aligns with science and physics (as far as it needs to, science can't contain all), but also provides so much more; Participation, mythology, practices, guidance of the Saints, Sacraments, iconography. How would one participate in idealism? It is not embodied as far as I can tell. It is going to be hard to beat the richness and depth of the mystical Logos theology of EO Christianity as far as I can tell.
AI is not the biggest threat at the moment. Quantum computing is far worse for everyone. They will be able to get into everyone’s bank account. That is what I call chaos .
Quantum computing may take our money but AI is taking our attention, which is more valuable.
You are right, of course in a certain way. Attention is a cherished mental factor as is mindfulness. And they are meant to be trained. Not many at it from what I can gather. But what I meant JR is that all these distractions are meant to place our attention elsewhere so the damage can be done without scrutiny - and then it is too late for anything. I mentioned money, (Of which I have none) ,but what I really meant is control. All of these things happening, like the pandemic lockdowns were tests geared towards control. How far can we press their buttons? I feel we still have a chance to fight it, but with Quantum computing it will be harder for us to have any kind of freedom. Everyone's attention will be arrested by survival and then there will be no place for discussions of any kind. We will be too busy looking for the next meal. How long can you fast for without loosing the rag? And can you watch others eat, while you are hungry and not feel like walloping someone over the head to ease your own discomfort ? This are the kind of things that concern me. The most civilised man can turn appy at a moments notice. I am a child of war, and I know what mankind is capable of. We all do. If things go pear shaped , am I training myself to continue to be kind and grateful as I should be at all times, or will I easily revert to my primal animalistic state if the shit really hits the fan? I am focusing on these kinds of questions to myself and how I can answer them today and tomorrow and in case chaos is unleashed upon us. No one can really tell what is coming. I know of three wars unleashed on citizens of the world , this world , our world , in the last three years. Above all else, I long for a peaceful earth. But a peaceful earth will come about when the minds of men are peaceful. And that looks like a mighty long time away. You will own. nothing and be happy. Funny because it is true (Homer would say), but it has to be accepted voluntary not imposed upon us. DOn't you think?
I agree with you mostly, but attention is not just a mental factor or function. The way in which we attend to the world manifests the world that we see. Attention is not a practice like mindfulness but is the very thing we interface with reality through. Dr Iain McGilchrist's work on the different types of attention that our brain hemispheres pay to the world, shows us what is at stake here if our we are dominated by the narrow and limited attention of the left-hemisphere. Entertain means 'to hold' and if we are captive to our screens and if it is all we 'pay' our attention to then we will lose touch with reality and we will die by insanity. Attention is our most valuable currency so we must be attentive to what we are paying it to.
I do know his work, he is incredible, but here I am using what I know of the mind from 35 years as a meditator and attention is a mental factor indeed, one of the 51 mental factors our mind has together with intention, mindfulness, faith , all mental factors so the idea is to look upon the mind as a diamond with many facets all of which need polishing and care. so like Bruce Lee referring to the body, you train all your muscles so that "when you need it, it does it all by itself (or something to that effect) so it is with the mind. train everything for the more training the better it work. I think I saw your name on another comment on a different substack post. I will check again. I do not spend more than half an hour replying even though sometimes I would like too. Yes, we have to control our impulses and not let ourselves be controlled by them. So I have to leave substack (comments) to actually write my next Wednesday post, but I enjoyed seeing the lady on Dr Iain McGilchrist's documentary (which name escapes me at the moment) and the lady that was in an accident and sculpted many brains. Every part of the brain records a kind of work, language, spacial awareness, etc. This was clear to me since ( I don't know if you recall) the awful sad case of the Romanian babies who did not get touch as part of their upbringing and parts of their brain was (dead) or underdeveloped or not developed at all. So people that have to have parts of their brain removed for whatever reason are showing us these things which I think it is incredible, but at what cost to each individual…
Well I suppose I disagree with your definition of attention, it sounds to me like you are talking about focus, which I see as being part of attention or a kind of attention. The other kind of attention has a much broader scope, more holistic and interconnected view of the world, which can’t be trained but can be ignored as it is more subtle and isn’t good at making money and manipulating but is essential for the health of the mind and soul.
With absolute honesty, since you asked, I'm inclined to pass because: 1) I just haven't the availability, 2) I've been in some real dire financial straights lately, and the big one, 3) climate change is not at all on my radar anymore. Civilization will be tanked long before it ever becomes a real issue—any of us paying attention can see society's free fall. And, if I'm to be really honest, I have zero trust anymore for the scientific community—they have been bought and corrupted just like medicine, education, and of course government. Many scientists emphatically state there is no climate crisis and others say we are doomed. What I do know, because I can see it with my own eyes, is that society as we've always known it is collapsing. Can you even imagine Western nations that will still be Western nations in 20 years? I'm rather concerned that, whether by international conflict or Islamic invasion, we will be sent back to the Dark Ages. That is the pressing peril I am concerned with. That said, I applaud you for your involvement with this event, it is just not of interest to me in my current state of disillusionment. I hope that you don't become dejected in any way but continue to pour your passion into this project. At the end of the day, we all still need to be thinking more sustainably about the long-term and that I can always get behind.
Your comment hit home - thank you for the resonant points you made. I am so disillusioned and dejected lately that it’s bordering on paralysis and affecting my ability to show up for much of anything. I signed up for Daniels offering out of curiosity and a need for solidarity.
Thank you, it will be a wonderful and important event. I am absolutely positive it will be encouraging to be a part of something with so many other concerned individuals. Sometimes it is very empowering to realize we are not alone in how we feel.
“What I do know, because I can see it with my own eyes, is that society as we've always known it is collapsing.” Well put Aaron. In my view, I wonder if we have exhausted the ‘benefits’ of democracy and capitalism which are now a joke. What ‘sphere’ could add another dimension to this ‘flatland’? Re that, I am reading Adventures in Quantumland” by Ruth E. Kastner and exploring Rudolf Steiner’s intriguingly radical concept of a “threefold social organism”.
Thank you, not familiar with the concept. I appreciate your comment and I'll try to research the threefold social "organism" (I read that incorrectly the first time—I think I have selective dyslexia). :)
I’m still trying to get a sense of it too. A place to start might be The Whole Social Substack. I’m sure Daniel is aware that the meditant Rudolf Steiner worked to apply his insights to practical alternatives in education, agriculture, medicine, the arts and also social forms.
Hey Daniel, take what I say with a grain of salt because I've often found that I enjoy learning at my own pace as opposed to online courses, and only really sign up for an online course if I feel there's someone I really admire that I want to learn from directly.
I'm honestly sick of courses that are just a collection of 1 hour seminars by different speakers. I find each person often just presents an intro to their ideas, and we never really get deep.
This is great if I want a broad intro to a topic, but these days I'm decently well versed in these things and courses only appeal if I feel there's going to be real depth.
This is why your esotericism course appeals to me more. It's not even the topic so much as the way you present it, you are structuring it in a way that I feel I'd learn a lot.
This particular course doesn't feel that way to me. I'd be more interested in you or you and one other person doing something thoughtfully structured and focused than an assortment of people each doing one hour stand alone seminars.
Again this is where my interests are and not necessarily representative of others. And again I am a self motivated learner and it's rare that I'd sign up for anything at this point, though just signed up for a Buddhist Geeks course on The Second Turning as I love the teachers and it's clear they are going into depth on topics that really interest me.
hmm can't there be different valuable and even fun approaches?
For sure, but I have limited time and money and I know what my priority is. I'd rather listen to podcasts for free on my own time to get a similar depth of information. For me courses are about going deep into certain topics, deeper than you can get in an hour or two.
Again, this is just my preference, how I prioritize my time and money.
I do think something is different about the live events even online... you are in the moment of creation of a possible new thought or idea. I think Gail B, Bill McKibben, etc, you will learn a lot from the time with them, no matter what.
Gee I guess I assumed that Daniel would do a kind of assimilation at the end… he’s so good at distilling complex ideas, synthesizing and making things clear. At least for me. Perhaps he will do something like that!
The Heart Room is open! Yes I find taking care of one’s own mind being the priority. If that is in good shape, then everything else is not so hard to bear . I find it important to contemplate what I did at the end of each day so that if I did not help, at least it did no harm. My
most pertinent question at the moment is not why things are so bad in this or that field of existence, but why do we have the karma to experience it in this way? At this particular time? We have been killing, pillaging and raping each other ever since we got here. It is not surprising to me that things are bad. I know they will probably get a lot worse . The predictions of displaced populations due to climate, war and what not is horrendous. Unfortunately, human nature, as well as noble it also has that side where until something really terrible happens to each of us personally, we rather brush it under the carpet. But karma always rippers. It is only a matter of time. I fell for instance that lockdown in general was good for humanity. People have been asleep. Covid made the intent of control more obvious. Our monetary system has always been a prison. A sophisticated kind of slavery, hidden by the complications of understanding such a complex system. A system specifically designed to keep us on a certain behavioral course. Convincente to the few. We have an alternative now, but will we grab that chance for financial freedom? Time will tell. But by now , freedom really means freedom from this unsatisfactory reality which no matter how many changes we can do to it, it will be always that- unsatisfactory. Suffering is its nature and to think that we can change the nature of that reality is foolish. Go forth, go forth and find true freedom!
I do toggle between feeling hopeless that we can effectively prevent collapse and just sort of trying not to think about it. To be honest I found the doom-sayers in the last seminar to be more on-target but depressing, and those with plans/ideas for how to live in accord with nature, etc to be kidding themselves and so that stuff frustrated me. It’s such an overwhelming thing for most of us to contemplate. I loved the talk you did with Jared Sexton. I think he’s dead on-target when he states that capitalism has sort of destroyed our ability to even imagine a better way of being in the world. I will think about signing up for the course some more. I’m most interested in the spiritual/mystical aspects of what we are going through. Somehow that resonates more to me than practical strategies for survival. Peace!
Hi Jon, Amazing if you can join, will be great to have you. I recommend Greer's book Dark Age America... feels like he might have a true perspective. But I can never shake Chris Bache's vision in Dark Night, Early Dawn entirely out of my head! Kind regards, D
And perhaps that titration is the solution our culture is being dissolved for. Like frogs getting used to the heat. Soup?
This may not be useful but the number of “summits” and conferences of all kinds, with highly knowledgeable people, is staggering. I don’t have time for any of them. My first thought is always the same: just send me the transcript. I can go through it in a fraction of the time.
Hello Brother
well what to say....sorry !
Is that enough? In brief. My wife and i spent over twenty years building an off-grid school based in Devon in the convivial style of illitch.... When parents came i said we could teach children how to spell consciousness but it may be more helpful to show and explore what that word may mean. We built a crucible (after Findhorn the early days, certainly not now) where everyone was welcome, where all had a unique gift to share and we said "yes" to almost everything. We held space to explore and experiment in a place of connection.
Daniel, after 20 odd years it was time to move on. What did i learn in that time? far more than this brief post will allow., but ..Well we learnt magic is real and we created a charming enchanted place of learning. We also gleaned that folk often want to use "your" crucible to place their stories in...a place where they can play at taking some weight, some responsibility (after vanessa andriotti and Stephen Jenkinson) but in reality. No not really. "No I dont really want to relinquish any of my stuff ,my money or privilege. In fact i dont even want to pay for your services because; "i am an artist" and a forest of other strange reasons to fracture and fragment.
We now find ourselves back at Findhorn (after 40 years) and its as messy and full of hubris as the rest of the planet. The community here is trying to buy the land from the effectively bankrupt Findhorn Foundation.
A few holding fast to the center. "can it hold"
Well who knows, perhaps not... but it has to be tried because we need to leave at least a sense or some small echo in the atmosphere for those that follow... a sense that someone gave a damn.
Daniel Bless you for the work you do.
Hi OAKWOOD, thanks! Interesting to learn about Findhorn today and your journey. I feel you would be a great participant for the seminar. As I have mentioned, we don't want money to be an obstacle so please, if you do want to join but the price is an issue, email us at hello@liminal.news and let's work it out.
Yes, another course by more "thought leaders," authors and political activists. It's overwhelming. And yes, everyone listed has done a tremendous amount of good. I applaud them, especial you, Daniel. I've "raged against the machine" since before the first Earth Day. I'm exhausted. I still try to give because I still receive. For me, though, I just want to chop wood and carry water. I don't need a course for that.
Hi Stevo, Thanks for your comment which makes sense to me. I think, though, if you follow my writing and my work, you should know that I at least have the aspiration to try to help build a different kind of social movement, one that is outside of the political duopoly and that has a foundation in a consciousness-based paradigm (monistic idealism). Personally, I think that is the only "hope" (although, on another level, everything is perfect, Samsara is Nirvana, and there is nothing to hope for or worry about). I feel that your exhaustion (and mine) would dissolve and turn into energetic inspiration if we could somehow get the ball rolling in a different direction... perhaps that is an impossible dream, but I prefer to hold onto some kind of impossible dream. Bringing aspects of the movement into dialogue and building community around it feels like a good first step... I can't guarantee there will be a second step, but we will try. Please consider taking the seminar - if the price is problematic, please message us about what feels good for you - hello@liminal.news
You assembled a great line up and I’m interested but, like many have commented here, I’ve been following these ideas for years. I started with Greer in 2006 and broadly accept his thesis that a slow, sporadic decline, punctuated with crisis is the future. Well, actually it’s the present and therein lies the issue. It feels like the time for talk and exploration is done- now we’re working on practical solutions. I realise I have a tenuous future in Communications now that AI has arisen. I know our politics in the UK is headed into authoritarian territory. I know wealth inequality is intensifying and what we have may yet be lost. I know we have all the solutions but we’re not putting them into action because there is scant support. Who will create a mutual society to cushion each others financial needs? Who will join a grassroots trade network to support our artistic and agricultural endeavours? We need to birth a new alternative.
I feel that is what the course is about hopefully - birthing an alternative
“Who will create a mutual society to cushion each others financial needs? Who will join a grassroots trade network to support our artistic and agricultural endeavours? We need to birth a new alternative.” Thank you Dan. And I propose expanding “support our artistic and agricultural endeavors” to include holistic self-motivating educational practice for children and youth to age 21.
I just developed a game to teach children about bees and pollination. If everyone is doing their best, we may be able to get somewhere .
I'm 80 years old and have lived and observed, in real time, through what I consider to be the most acceleratingly destructive period in the history of our democracy. Daniel, I believe that I have contacted you about this before, but in your course description didn't notice any reference to my primary concern, that being humanity's handicap -- which is now, and always have been, those 1% of us who are psychopathic. Until we rapidly utilize the new technology that, for the first time in human history, have at our disposal -- we are certainly doomed!
Terry Sneller
www.nomoreinsanity.org
Yes the psychopath problem is one of the biggest issues, we agree. It would be something great to explore in this seminar.
Yes. That’s the so-called “fall” (failure to rise) - that cold fear that shrinks our soul into selfish greedy takers and users. I think this theme rose to the top again with the academy-award winning new film The Zone of Interest.
I sometimes wonder if those traits we label “psychopathic” or “sociopathic “ are merely adaptive evolutionary strategies. Like cockroaches of the mind.
They ARE! Read THIS link for some documentation on that subject:
https://dissidentvoice.org/2008/05/beware-the-psychopath-my-son/
or like many “mental Health diagnoses, simply not yet understood. Like neuro plasticity.
Oh no, there is a Canadian Doctor who has spent 38+years developing what is now considered the international Gold Standard test for psychopathy.
http://www.hare.org/awards/
perhaps becasue it's a bit of an old template..Daniel..." big names", beaucoup $$ ....same tired " lecture type" format...?
perhaps THIS type of gathering...could inspire a bit more more..
this KIND of format...
https://peopleofredmountain.com/2024/03/14/protect-mcdermitt-caldera/
sponsored by Tribes in Nevada in mid April....survival, ...ceremonies APRIL 14
..It's FREE it's networking there's a raffle 😘🍀..people are fed .and it plans to call into ACTION....protests against lithium mines, out West, on native lands ...perhaps start with what we can DO....refuse to buy into for instance " electric cars are GREEN"...etc xo
Sounds cool but why Either / or ?
yikes!! NEVER..EVER..either or....for silly goose sakes!.... I was saying, if you read carefully, that perhaps your sad arises from non interest...because you are using a tired burned out model for gathering people together: pay $$$ ..meet " big names" and listen to lectures etc. argh... it may be your FORMAT is a turn off ... and so I provided a link to an event addressing survival concerns in a way that is grassroots, inclusive. .as an example of how you MIGHT frame your " events" differently...all this shared because you solicited feedback via " sad" persona....you see?
Just for input here antoinette.
Critiquing Daniel's event and emotions using quotation marks makes you look bad.
hmm....my dear...Daniel ASKED for feedback....did you see that in his essay here?? I offered it in earnest...
and I was quoting, Daniel. by using his own word...."sad" as to HONOR his very own sentiments ...am personally not into banter here.....and I sure hope my reply to Daniel cleared up the " either or" conjecture about which he was querying. maybe you aren't following the entire stream of discourse Jess...hard to know. that all said....I've never worn make-up..never HAVE worried about " looking bad"...( yes quoting YOU....Whilst smiling, with peace sign flashin) xo
"Thank you" for your response.
are you quoting...yourself??!! lol
old school ....mostly.
only occasionally do i use quotes to be
" sarcastic"..o my... ( smiling) ...
sidebar: ....but it's interesting that you took those little Chas Chas as mean spirited. truth? I lOvE daniel..2 decades and counting..synchronicities found us...he knows ..xo
Sounds amazing, Antoinette. Thanks for sharing. I’m not on Facebook. Can the info be found elsewhere?
hi Erin.... thanks for caring....yes gotcha... I just changed the link...to hook up with the WEBSITE ...here, for your convenience.... xo
...https://peopleofredmountain.com/2024/03/14/protect-mcdermitt-caldera/
Thanks very much!!!
I felt sad when I read your message Daniel, about the lack of response to this course, and I just signed up. I hestitated yesterday because I'm trying to save money, and I very much appreciated the discount. I have a lot of admiration for the work you and your colleagues are doing in bringing this together, and in my capacity as a climate journalist, I have had extensive interactions with several of your speakers. I'm excited about the sessions and plan to write about them for my newsletter Resonant World which seeks to bring a collective and inter-generational trauma lens to the climate crisis, and our crises more broadly. (I also loved How Soon is Now, which I can remember buying in Watkins Books in London when it came out). See you there!